tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4807826652341078989.post5295668009593721435..comments2023-11-24T06:43:02.286+00:00Comments on Aspicientes in Jesum: A married priesthood?Pastor in Montehttp://www.blogger.com/profile/05949810648656544072noreply@blogger.comBlogger12125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4807826652341078989.post-8853050252865486452013-03-06T12:36:41.524+00:002013-03-06T12:36:41.524+00:00Boniface -- the account of Peter's wife is men...Boniface -- the account of Peter's wife is mentioned in Eusebius (3:30 History of the Church) wherein he quotes the story as related by Clement of Alexandria in Clement's Stromata (7.11) "They say, accordingly, that the blessed Peter, on seeing his wife led to death, rejoiced on account of her call and conveyance home, and called very encouragingly and comfortingly, addressing her by name, Remember the Lord. Such was the marriage of the blessed and their perfect disposition towards those dearest to them."<br />gemoftheoceanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05521207668262592414noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4807826652341078989.post-75262376368089912172013-02-28T17:46:20.340+00:002013-02-28T17:46:20.340+00:00Just for the record, Peter was apparently married ...Just for the record, Peter was apparently married right up till the time of his crucifixion. There is an account (can't remember where) that his wife was put to death at the same time as he, and that as she was dragged away, Peter yelled, "Remember Christ!" to her.Bonifacehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10672810254075072214noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4807826652341078989.post-23222878831654654192013-02-28T03:54:53.598+00:002013-02-28T03:54:53.598+00:00Those who like to use the fact that the Orthodox a...Those who like to use the fact that the Orthodox allow married men to become priests as a stick to beat against the celibate RC priesthood tend to forget that there are celibate Orthodox priests as well. Those that are, are expected to live with brother priests and are never alone and these do not include the hieromonks.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4807826652341078989.post-15025061025614328392013-02-26T12:33:25.328+00:002013-02-26T12:33:25.328+00:00The idea of celibacy will always be a ‘sign of con...The idea of celibacy will always be a ‘sign of contradiction’ for many people – more so today when sex is viewed as a <i>sine qua non</i> for everyone. Yes, it is a rule for the Latin Church – not an article of faith. While it is not for everyone and some priests fail at it, I don’t believe it should be abandoned.<br /><br />When I applied for a dispensation over 40 years ago, it was not because I was opposed to celibacy. I had been a religious in vows before ordination, so celibacy was not imposing anything more than what I had already undertaken years earlier. My reason was that I felt I could not adhere to my vows for the rest of my life – that I had taken on more than I could achieve <i>pace</i> God’s words to St. Paul: “My grace is sufficient for thee”. One still has to cooperate with grace…<br /><br />I did not want to be a married priest, but I wanted the option to get married. Not that I had already found someone and wanted to ‘legalize’ it (I wouldn’t meet my future wife until some years after the dispensation was granted). I wanted to be able to look for someone to spend the rest of my life with. I thank God for allowing this and the mercy of the Church in granting it.<br /><br />I have the greatest regard and appreciation for the multitude of priests who remain faithful to celibacy and its powerful witness in the Church. I also have profound admiration for the priests – like Fr. Hunwicke, Fr. Longenecker and the priests of the Orthodox Church – who have managed to successfully combine the priesthood and marital life.<br /><br />Both are blessings for the Church, neither to be disparaged.GORhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14313101159848740722noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4807826652341078989.post-54473456321245710852013-02-25T17:41:06.820+00:002013-02-25T17:41:06.820+00:00I sometimes wonder whether the "shortage of p...I sometimes wonder whether the "shortage of priests" that we hear so much about, is as real as it first appears. I also wonder the relatively small element of it that is real is, in part, a self inflicted problem. <br /><br /><br />Firstly, take a look at the stastics for the Mass going Cathioic populations in 1965 and in 2010. Then have a look at the numbers of priests in 1965 and in 2010. Compare the ratio of priests to practicing catholics in 1965 and 2010. It will be observed that the ratio of priests to practicing Catholics has declined, but not hugely. <br /><br />Then consider how many priests were imported from Ireland in the first half of the twentieth centuary and up to about 1970. I do not have statistics for this, but I could well believe that Irish priests accounted for around 25% of the total in 1965. After making an adjustment for imported Irish priests, I think that you will find that the ratio of priests to active Catholics today is not so different from the figure forty years ago.<br /><br />Changes in society at large, may be responsible for some of this relatively small decline. However, there is another factor to look at. There will be many for whom the priesthood ceased to be an attractive proposition because of changes in the Church, and in particular the liturgy. <br /><br />I know that we are getting into the area of hypothetical arguments, but I would hazard a guess that if the Church had been more sympathetic to those who found the liturgical and other changes hard to accept, there would be many more priests now. To put a figure on it for England and Wales, we could be talking of an average of 15 ordinations per year for 40 years. That is 600 priests possibly lost.<br /><br />With 600 molre priests, I doubt whether there would be much talk of priest shortage.Et Expectohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04273064434098923960noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4807826652341078989.post-85419027135352618962013-02-25T13:26:06.538+00:002013-02-25T13:26:06.538+00:00An excellent, balanced, and moderate post.An excellent, balanced, and moderate post.Tom Piataknoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4807826652341078989.post-10535955271267986312013-02-24T21:40:32.200+00:002013-02-24T21:40:32.200+00:00While it is frequently asked if marriage would be ...While it is frequently asked if marriage would be good for the priesthood the question of whether in fact the priesthood would be good or not for marriages or for families is less often considered. How many families suffer from spouses who put careers first?Patriciushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08906131174326742939noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4807826652341078989.post-44300218627152378572013-02-24T21:17:18.502+00:002013-02-24T21:17:18.502+00:00Anonymous,
Take care lest you substitute your own...Anonymous,<br /><br />Take care lest you substitute your own will for that of Christ. The priesthood/episcopate, as established by Him, was one of only optional celibacy. If clerical marriage is OK by Christ, who is any human being to gainsay it??<br /><br />And - those married Eastern-rite priests might like to hear from you that they are not fathers in Christ to their flocks.<br /><br />+ WolseyAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4807826652341078989.post-70169010895368911072013-02-24T14:06:15.714+00:002013-02-24T14:06:15.714+00:00My newish parish priest is a married ex-Anglican a...My newish parish priest is a married ex-Anglican and I definitely think it's second best. The 'undivided heart' thing. He's a good and holy man but just not my father in Christ. <br /><br />I think it must be jolly undermining for good and faithful seminarians and priests to have to listen to all this kind of stuff. We need your witness! I think the Church would just sink into the mud of the world if married priests became the norm. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4807826652341078989.post-71268193579326031402013-02-24T09:12:12.494+00:002013-02-24T09:12:12.494+00:00Many years ago, one of the priests at our parish h...Many years ago, one of the priests at our parish had been a Trappist monk; I suppose he must have been asked to give some help for a tiime. He told the story of being asked to leave the monastery and go to work with the still-existing leper colony on one of the Far North Australian islands. I shall never forget the timbre of his voice - it gave me goosebumps - when he said it was the first time he had truly appreciated his vow of celibacy, because he was free to go; had he been a married man, the decision would have been so very much harder.<br />I must admit that since hearing him speak, I have often thought that it wouldn't be such a terrible idea to have married priests - there will always be the very holy, monastic men, who give their lives and their vocations to doing difficult and demanding things in the world; but I can see, too, that there would be a role for married Parish clergy.They too, would serve joyfully.<br />Not everyone is called to celibacy - and finances aside, should that preclude the taking of Holy Orders?<br />There is a married priest, with six children, at one of the local parishes here - he converted from his Anglican orders a few years ago, and was appointed to a very large parish which was well able to support his family.Maureenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02383223698959645624noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4807826652341078989.post-90704712778344439892013-02-24T01:59:12.122+00:002013-02-24T01:59:12.122+00:00Not true.
To start, read Heinz-Jurgen Vogels'...Not true.<br /><br />To start, read Heinz-Jurgen Vogels' works, "Celibacy: gift or law?" and "Alone against the Vatican". He hits the arguments in favour of either a law of priestly celibacy or continence within marriage right out of the park, both of which are premised on the alleged impurity of sex, which contradicts infallible teaching (as represented, e.g. by St Thomas Aquinas). Furthermore, I remember although I cannot now provide the citation, a statement of St Hilary of Poitiers indicating that even after the receipt of holy orders, that it was permitted to beget children. <br /><br />For pshychological reasons, there's been a lot of dishonesty in the Latin church about this question, for several hundreds of years.<br /><br />+ WolseyAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4807826652341078989.post-6917438981983718332013-02-23T23:57:43.815+00:002013-02-23T23:57:43.815+00:00Marriage after ordination has never been practised...Marriage after ordination has never been practised in the Church, therefore, a priest doesn't seek a wife, get married. See Fr Hunwicke's comment on Fr Blake's blog. Lyndanoreply@blogger.com